Ok, so I am new to message boards full stop. But I find that this one is a hard one to join.

I was born and raised in Salt Lake City, and of course was raised in a staunch mormon household. Growing up, I always had questions. It seemed there were certain things that never made sense, and those things fell under the "you have to have faith" umbrella. I am not sure if I would consider myself an 'ex mormon' or not. Saying that, I have not regularly attended church for nearly five years. Throughout my adult life I have had periods of activity within the church, and long periods on inactivity. During those inactive times, I still considered myself to be a member, just taking a break.

I lived in England for 10 years, my husband is not a member, and while we lived in England I was very active. I taught sunday school, I was in the relief society presidency. We moved back to Utah five years ago. I came first because his visa (he's not an american citizen) had not come through in time. In the year that I was here without him, I tried to go to church. My kids were little, and it had always been hard for me to attend with three very small boys. Initially I got fed up with taking them because they were too young to sit there, and I was only one person. I could not entertain and keep three quiet. So, I took one of my breaks.

During this break, I had repeated visits from the Bishop and Relief Society President. It got to be so much, that I had made the decision I did not want to return for a while. When my husband joined, we were further shunned by our church going neighbors because he wasn't a member (of course no one will admit this).

I grew angry that the people around me were acting less than Christian when it came to my husband and my kids. My kids weren't allowed to play with certain other kids, and my husband might as well have been invisible.

Saying all that, I guess I really started to question the validity of the church when I went back to school. I want to be a biology teacher, and learning more about evolution started a whole chain reaction on how any of it can be true.

Is there anyone else out there that cant make peace with God vs Evolution?

I am finding myself in a place where I want to find a way to rid myself of the guilt my religion has placed on me, but I am not sure what to do.

I look forward to your comments

Jillene

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"I find your lack of faith disturbing." -- Darth Vader

Welcome Jillene!

I'm a retired life science teacher who has weathered the LDS suppression of some scientific evidence that seriously challenges LDS beliefs..religion and science never mixed well in my classrooms, as the texts adopted by the local districts, thru the "approved list" tendered for selection/adoption by the State Office of Education, were, how shall I say this? Lacking in a lot of aspects concerning many accepted evolutionary concepts...they pick texts that skirt the issues...much the same in Utah History classes...the overall suppression comes in many subtle forms generally not very well noticed by most beginning educators nor their unsuspecting students.

I hope your last "break" from peepstoned Joe's alegorical business is of a more permanent nature.

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"When authority masquerades as a power, a simple question will unmask it."

"Just because you think, feel, or believe something is true, doesn't make it true!"

"The doubt of your faith, is not God testing you, but truth trying to emerge and free you."

Thanks for the reply, Mythbusters

There comes a time when you have to get off the fence, and I think now is my time. I can't in good conscience keep going the way I have been. It doesn't make sense to me. I need more answers. I think my 'break' will be permanent this time.

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"I find your lack of faith disturbing." -- Darth Vader

Hi Jillene. Welcome!

Since leaving the LDS church, I've been told that my stepson can't have certain kids over anymore. I guess apostates are too scary for members to deal with. No, that's not very christian of them.

Evolution? I guess if you go with intelligent design and an alegorical 7 days it can fit together. I think there are many amazing things in the creation, things which to me speak of a higher power being involved. Maybe the same power that created the Bang of the Big Bang. But if you want to say that the earth was created several thousand years ago ... that's hard to swallow.

If you're into biology and considering a permanent break, you are well positioned to understand the DNA issues involved with the Book of Mormon. Let me recommend that you investigate that for a while. There's a good video on it:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=svfxSscxh8o
or you may like the book, "Losing a Lost Tribe"
http://www.amazon.com/Losing-Lost-Tribe ... 1560851813


Peace

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I resigned from the Church of THE Jesus Christ of the Latter Day Saints (Feb 2011)

"For nothing is secret, that shall not be made manifest; neither any thing hid, that shall not be known and come abroad." - Luke 8:17

Jillene,

What will make sense to you, is sticking around here, and asking questions..

And when you do, remember something I used to tell all my students on the first day of class...if you don't understand something ask questions..."The only 'dumb' question is the one not asked." I(WE here) am/are not one of those 'know it alls' like some are, but will share with you and others what I/WE do know.

_________________
"When authority masquerades as a power, a simple question will unmask it."

"Just because you think, feel, or believe something is true, doesn't make it true!"

"The doubt of your faith, is not God testing you, but truth trying to emerge and free you."

Welcome! Mythbusters fan? Awesome! Got the same silent treatment when I left years ago. It is sad that people are like that, and it really is contrary to the concept of Christian fellowshipping. I offer this quote from Mythbuster Adam Savage from Saturday's Reason Rally:


It has been the experience of my long life that the only way to counteract negativity is to be proactive. You accomplish nothing in bitterness, regret or fear. Take strength from who you are and realize you are better than the small minded people around you.

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"We establish no religion in this country, we command no worship, we mandate no belief, nor will we ever. Church and state are, and must remain separate."
Ronald Reagan

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"I find your lack of faith disturbing." -- Darth Vader

Stick close to uncovering the terrible and outright fraud Mormonism demonstrates.

Six thousand years is as possibly comprehensible as six thousand at the time of writing Genesis.

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God of Poly-Folly Folly

{ If you believe in things that you don't understand, then you suffer ~ Stevie Wonder }
.................. www.­tudou.­com/­programs/­view/­7Q0q-­Vv8sHQ/
.............. http://www.tudou.com/programs/view/7Q0q-Vv8sHQ/
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God of Poly-Folly Folly

This is a very good critique of the Book of Mormon written by a Jewish person, based on his scholarship of Judaism. Not too long, but really makes a good argument.
http://www.yadlachimusa.org.il/?Categor ... icleID=603

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"We establish no religion in this country, we command no worship, we mandate no belief, nor will we ever. Church and state are, and must remain separate."
Ronald Reagan

Welcome to the forums!

Nice to have you here. It is a healthy place for discussions of all kinds. Evolution vs. God? Yeah, thats a tough one. It seems there will never be a satisfying answer to many of the questions we all desire to know.

What I have decided is that believing in evolution doesn't disprove that there is a God, but it just clashes with the biblical sense of what God is. Unless you want to start making the arguments of literal vs. metaphorical etc etc.

Noah's ark is another one of those types of stories. All of those species of animals on one boat? Seriously?

That reminded me of one of Ricky Gervais stand up routines. It's hilarious. Warning: some spicy language.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ln64DYflGT4

I don't see why God and evolution can not mix. One law of physics is Entropy, in simple terms: everything over time deteriorates into a state of chaos. So if a car is parked for 200 years, we will have a pile of rust. Evolution on the other hand, pushes life forward into a better state of existance. My questions would be, why does anything evolve foreward, what is the motivation for this? Why does grass grow? Why does anything want to progress foreward and become better?
What bothers me, is that people use religion as an excuse to be ignorant. "If it has nothing to do with my eternal salvation, I don't need to study it." This attutude can be so annoying.

When I was about 19 years old I read a tract on the subject of Creation. It dealt with the spinneret of a spider which is a very complex design, and, among the obvious questions were: ‘Why would the spinneret continue to evolve forward over the period in which it served no useful purpose?’ (this period would supposedly be millions of years)

That pamphlet shook my faith in Evolution.

Then, about 4 years later I ended up in Bible College and I took a course on Creation/Evolution. The teacher became a Christian after finding order in the Universe that did not make sense to him from an evolutionary model.

Over the years I have found that there are many scientists who also believe in Creation.

If you care to research sites on the subject of Creation please check out:

http://www.creationscience.com/onlinebook/
http://www.creationism.org/
http://www.answersingenesis.org/
http://www.discovercreation.org/

All of these links are found on my site’s link’s page. I do not ignore the subject; but, I do let more knowledgeable people convey the message. I believe in choosing my battles carefully; and, it would take too much of my time to do the subject justice.

Rich

Welcome, Jillene.
It looks like your gradual loosening of the ties is being forced into third gear by the shunning of your neighbors, among other things. I have friends who have interracial marriages. The looks they get sometimes, I think are the closest to what I see couples get who are half-mormon half-gentile. I don't much care for it, either way. I used to stare, too, so I should be a bit more forgiving. But I've seen the (unjustified) discrimination too long; I don't want to see it any more.

I had a friend who had some strange ideas. He took me to his ward. As we approached, a member of the ward "greeted" him, scowling, with obvious disgust and a clearly unmormon title. That was the first time I saw that. I was shocked. I couldn't help but wonder if these were a "different" kind of mormon, maybe going into apostacy. Well, I got over that. And my friend didn't complain, to his credit.

Whatchagotta do, is get in touch with other exmembers, and meet with them, share your stories, have fun together. That's just my opinion, because it worked for me and some others I know.

Anyway, whatever you decide - and I mean whatever you decide, you're welcome here.

Thanks Abinadi,

I, like you, can understand to a point where the staring comes from. I can understand peoples curiosity, my complaint comes from active members subtle suggestions on how to 'fit in'. I have never met a bunch of un-Christian Christians. i dont recall the part of the story where Jesus mixes on the wrong side of town, and then points out the ways they need to change in order to fit in to the acceptable group. Maybe I missed something.

I appreciate everyone who has made me feel welcome, and i especially appreciate the reference, links, etc to further studies.

I look forward to being part of this forum.

Jillene

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"I find your lack of faith disturbing." -- Darth Vader

Welcome!

When I was active, I adopted the apologist thinking of "well, the scriptures don't say HOW God created everything, so maybe evolution was the tool He used." And I remember hearing the concept of "we don't know how much time they REALLY meant when they said God created everything in six days."

I'm much more skeptical now. More than evolutionary science, the thing that poked holes was the history. The fact is that there weren't horses in pre-Columbian America, but the Book of Mormon mentions them a few times. That, along with the historical inaccuracies regarding metalworking and DNA evidence are the pieces that really clicked with me.

Aside from the fact that church just made me miserable, that is. That was really the primary reason.

I'm a Master's student in psychology, and what really got me was reading about cults. Once I realized that people can and will believe anything if they're set up to, it was a matter of time before I began to recognize the same thought/behavior manipulation in the Church.

I hope you find this board supportive. I know it's been a really useful tool for me while I've gone through recovery and rediscovered myself.

-Lavender

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"If Lions could think, their Gods would have a mane and roar." - Xenophanes

"Wow! So the Bible is really a trilogy, and the Book of Mormon is 'Return of the Jedi?' I'm interested!" - Elder Cunningham, The Book of Mormon

Thanks Lavender,

It's really hard to know where to turn sometimes. I feel so guilty for feeling the way I do, but yet I am miserable when I try to do the things that are allegedly the right thing.

I'm glad to know there are others out there that feel the same.

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"I find your lack of faith disturbing." -- Darth Vader