Ok David, I suspect that what you have seen here from ex-Mormons is different than what you thought you'd see. Am I right about that? We're not the awful people you may have thought we were before you introduced yourself here, are we?

So here is my question for you. No doubt you are sold on Christianity but I am curious to what extent you are sold on the truthfulness of the Mormon church. I know you believe historical exaggeration exists among "anti-Mormons" but to what extend do you give credence to the negative information against the church? Can you honestly say that you know the Mormon church is the one and only true church? That you know Joseph Smith restored the church directly from God as he claimed? That you know each and every subsequent president of the Mormon church was/is a true prophet of God? That you know the Book of Mormon and all other Mormon scripture are the word of God per claims made by the church?

I hope you choose to respond and to be totally honest since we have done the same with all of your questions. Remember, you are anonymous.

_________________
Dipsnort, sniper of truth and aspiring Harriet Tubman of Mormonism

This radical side we are seeing IS as wild and open as he can dare to get. And us all, still see it as closed off as any TBM out there. Ahh... to truly be anonymous and free with the troublesome ideas that behave like a frantic monkey attached to thr back of the shoulders. Let's give a wild and longstanding cheer for David and his anonymously driven quest to go as far as he did. Hipp, Hipp, Hooray! Hipp, Hipp, Hoorah!

_________________
God of Poly-Folly Folly

{ If you believe in things that you don't understand, then you suffer ~ Stevie Wonder }
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God of Poly-Folly Folly

I appreciate the invitation. This has been an interesting process. I initially responded to the Parley P. Pratt article on the site and was disgusted by the tone in it and how blatantly biased and slanted the information was. I did anticipate the same attitude in the forums and have seen a little of that but far more understanding and openness than I thought I would. I understand the pain and frustration that many experience who leave the church. And I have additional insight into how the church pushes itself more than it thinks it does. The focus is not quite on Christ in the ways it should be. I have learned this much.

I'll be perfectly honest with you. When I first started posting and read how well-worded the responses were, it became very uncomfortable. It would be impossible to learn much of the negatives and not have your faith in the church shaken. I honestly feel like a lot of the negative history is exaggerated and could be understood in light of who said it and why. There are those who would have you believe that Joseph Smith is Satan himself. But, there are also all the journal statements, etc., of those who testified he was a prophet of God. Why such a disparity? As I had doubts and tried to understand everything negative, it became clear that any certain assessment from information provided would be an impossibility for me. We don't have perfect records and every little bit of information is so very slanted for or against. I had to have another way to figure things out.

I admit I didn't know what to do about this problem. But as I would read the Book of Mormon or saw the temple pictures in my house or, what really did it, review the Everything I Need to Know I Learned in Primary (http://theideadoor.com/index.php?option ... cle&id=149) poster on my daughter's bedroom door, things would sort of realign for me. And, I assure you, this realignment wasn't because those other things went away, but sort of fell where they should, I guess. This church I'm in and involved with, I know as certain as day, is a good thing. I've had to disconnect the things I can't explain and don't like with what I really feel is good. I can absolutely see how one could leave without hesitation once all the negative information is processed.

But despite all of this, I would open the Book of Mormon, peruse through verses I've highlighted in my years of study and there was just no denying it's power and truth to bring me closer to Christ. And I had a choice to make. I could walk away in frustration, and this was a very real consideration, or I could set the things I don't like and don't understand aside in favor of what I know, through what I feel. Now, I am not trying to discredit those who "feel" things in other ways (a good movie or whatever else) but I have had enough personal experiences that literally changed my life to know to trust that feeling. And that feeling, my "gut" feeling, is that this is right and good and to stay with it.

Now, I don't mean for my answer to your question to take away from anyone else reading this who would disagree. I just hope it helped paint the picture you were asking about.

Thanks for the response. I definitely noticed that you failed to answer the specific questions I put forth about your testimony and that is very telling.

I remember how hard it was for me to bear my testimony as a member and so I very rarely did. It felt extremely dishonest to say "I know" something is when in reality I didn't know and actually suspected the opposite. I hope you are able to sort all of this out for yourself at some point. Your heart is in the right place, no doubt about it.

Just one more question because I'm nosy. Do you care to share what church calling(s) you hold?

_________________
Dipsnort, sniper of truth and aspiring Harriet Tubman of Mormonism

Back to the basics again, David...did you do your homework as asked? Ya, know, getting the basics is a step in the right direction..that Fawn Brodie book...about as dry a history book as one would want to read...but so fact filled with well documented church history..just look at the footnotes at the bottom of her pages..you couldn't ask for anything better than that...

_________________
"When authority masquerades as a power, a simple question will unmask it."

"Just because you think, feel, or believe something is true, doesn't make it true!"

"The doubt of your faith, is not God testing you, but truth trying to emerge and free you."

The same with me. I find hard time to believe people, but it is very easy to believe Spirit. That is the foundation of my faith.
I read on pro-mormon forum that JS didn't have any children with other women, so it means there is no proof that he had sexual relationship with them. That is a theory as I understand.
I may trust people who say this or I may not trust them. But when I hear prayer during Sacrament when we bless bread and water, those words to me like a magic. They affect me very strongly, I just know that they were inspired by God. I read teachings of the Prophets and I just know they are from God, they have very strong affect on me. When I heard first time that I lived before I was born and it was my choice to be born and live here on earh, I cried because I was so happy to hear it. I was so much affected. I believe it is truth from God. I believe that baptism for the daed is from God. I see so much good happens in the Church. I can not reject all this just because somebody say something negative about Church, something that I am not witness myself.
But I do agree that there are members that do things that I would never expect LDS would do. But I do not judge them. We all need Christ, we all need to repent every day of our lives.

_________________
THE TIME WILL COME WHEN NO MAN OR WOMAN WILL BE ABLE TO ENDURE ON BORROWED LIGHT. EACH WILL HAVE TO BE GUIDED BY THE LIGHT WITHIN HIMSELF. IF YOU DO NOT HAVE IT, HOW CAN YOU STAND?
- Heber C. Kimball, 1856

Alright, we all need Christ, we need to repent everyday. Agreed.

God is leading you somewhere, no?
Question is: Will you go? And, is it worth the risk?

_________________
God of Poly-Folly Folly

{ If you believe in things that you don't understand, then you suffer ~ Stevie Wonder }
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God of Poly-Folly Folly

I believe that God is leading any person who seeks this.

I am not sure I understand. What do you mean?

_________________
THE TIME WILL COME WHEN NO MAN OR WOMAN WILL BE ABLE TO ENDURE ON BORROWED LIGHT. EACH WILL HAVE TO BE GUIDED BY THE LIGHT WITHIN HIMSELF. IF YOU DO NOT HAVE IT, HOW CAN YOU STAND?
- Heber C. Kimball, 1856

Disciples of Jesus found themselves terribly disappointed at the time of his death on the cross, so how is it you might not meet a similar tragic awakening to the ways of our lord and the misfortune of what we all sometimes first think is true?
And maybe then it all takes a comepletely different turn. The drastic change or turn that we do not understand until much, much later on in time.

_________________
God of Poly-Folly Folly

{ If you believe in things that you don't understand, then you suffer ~ Stevie Wonder }
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God of Poly-Folly Folly

This sense of happiness outweighs your sense of cognitive dissonance, then?

As for myself...I never could bear that for long. I also had experienced very little growth from Christ in the three years preceding my leaving, despite my best attempts and diligence in doing as I was told.

If your answer is yes to my question, all I have to say is--good luck. The road you choose is not easy, but if you feel it's the right one, then the best of luck to you.

It is very hard to be happy when we have to do what we don't want to do.
When I became a member I knew that one day I will go to the Temple and I will wear garments. And I had so many cute tank tops that I just adored. I had to make real sacifice. I was not very happy. I can tell you that. I also liked to have attention from men. I just enjoyed when they stared at me. It was not right away that I knew about modesty. One day I was walkin on the street and suddenly this thought appeared in my head:"Alla, the way you feel yourself right now is not the way Lord's disciple would feel herself. Married Daughter of God doesn't have in her heart disire to flirt with other men".
So, I didn't feel very happy. I loved to flirt with men. But that thought that I trully believe came to me from God by the power of the Holy Ghost effected me very strongly. I just KNEW that what I loved to do was wrong. Not because "flesh and blood" told me that, but Spirit.
If any person would tell me something like that I would be angry at that person. But when Spirit told me I just wanted to accept GOD'S WILL.
Now I am happy. I don't need to flirt with men, because I told God that I want to accept His will but He has to help me not to have this desire in my heart any more. God helped me, it took a while.
If I am a lesbian I have a desire to have sexual relationship with another girl and when I do that I feel happy. But when I know BY THE POWER OF THE SPIRIT that God doesn't want me to do that I am not happy. If prophet tells me that I don't have to that I am not happy even 100 times more.
But if I know in my heart that God is not happy when I have sex with another girl I want to follow His will. I ask Him to help me not to have that desire any more. That is why it is so important to have Spirit as a Teacher. When Spirit teaches:"do not do this, or do that" it is easier to obey God. When "flesh and blood" tells "do this, do not do that" it is very hard to obey. It is impossible to be happy or find it easy to do.
Good luck to you, too. From my heart.

_________________
THE TIME WILL COME WHEN NO MAN OR WOMAN WILL BE ABLE TO ENDURE ON BORROWED LIGHT. EACH WILL HAVE TO BE GUIDED BY THE LIGHT WITHIN HIMSELF. IF YOU DO NOT HAVE IT, HOW CAN YOU STAND?
- Heber C. Kimball, 1856

Yes.

I will if I have faith. I don't feel like I risk. When I do what I believe is right there is no even thought or feeling about any risk. It feels so safe.

_________________
THE TIME WILL COME WHEN NO MAN OR WOMAN WILL BE ABLE TO ENDURE ON BORROWED LIGHT. EACH WILL HAVE TO BE GUIDED BY THE LIGHT WITHIN HIMSELF. IF YOU DO NOT HAVE IT, HOW CAN YOU STAND?
- Heber C. Kimball, 1856

The right way or the safe way? I didn't know that they always were the same, as was the mission to grab bin Laden both right and safe for the Navy Seals?

_________________
God of Poly-Folly Folly

{ If you believe in things that you don't understand, then you suffer ~ Stevie Wonder }
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God of Poly-Folly Folly

To me "right" is always "safe". When I do what is right I am not in danger. And I am talking about salvation of my soul. Sometimes to do the right is not safe in earthly terms, but it is always safe in eternal terms.

_________________
THE TIME WILL COME WHEN NO MAN OR WOMAN WILL BE ABLE TO ENDURE ON BORROWED LIGHT. EACH WILL HAVE TO BE GUIDED BY THE LIGHT WITHIN HIMSELF. IF YOU DO NOT HAVE IT, HOW CAN YOU STAND?
- Heber C. Kimball, 1856

For soul's sake, don't dare and follow antyhing false or possibly provable as worse yet, and entirely made up.

_________________
God of Poly-Folly Folly

{ If you believe in things that you don't understand, then you suffer ~ Stevie Wonder }
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God of Poly-Folly Folly

Do you know how many God's children follow false or entirely made up? Too many.
If you love God and your neighbor then you follow what is true and real.

_________________
THE TIME WILL COME WHEN NO MAN OR WOMAN WILL BE ABLE TO ENDURE ON BORROWED LIGHT. EACH WILL HAVE TO BE GUIDED BY THE LIGHT WITHIN HIMSELF. IF YOU DO NOT HAVE IT, HOW CAN YOU STAND?
- Heber C. Kimball, 1856

Those are the exact words that have turned on you. Hold on tightly because you are now an ExMormon but don't quite yet have the capacity to come to grips with reality.

Best thing you might try and remember, is that this thing about talking it out with others really seems to somehow be a good process in overcoming the steep learning curve up ahead.

_________________
God of Poly-Folly Folly

{ If you believe in things that you don't understand, then you suffer ~ Stevie Wonder }
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God of Poly-Folly Folly

To love God and love my neighbor are the most important commandments. To love God is to follow Jesus's example- to be baptized in HIS Church, not somebody's church. To follow Jesus is to observe Sabbath and to go to Sacrament meeting in HIS CHurch not somebody's church.
God will judge house of Israel and He will judge gentiles.
I want and like to be part of House of Israel. It was my dream for a long time. It is not a dream any more. It is reality.
I know that to be covenant with God means KEEP PROMISES that you made to your God. Don't change your mind later. Because He will not be obligated to His promises anymore. I DO BELIEVE THAT.

_________________
THE TIME WILL COME WHEN NO MAN OR WOMAN WILL BE ABLE TO ENDURE ON BORROWED LIGHT. EACH WILL HAVE TO BE GUIDED BY THE LIGHT WITHIN HIMSELF. IF YOU DO NOT HAVE IT, HOW CAN YOU STAND?
- Heber C. Kimball, 1856

Oh, glad to have met the very first person whom never breaks promises to God. Holy hell, I never thought this day would come. Is this a story or are you going to stick to a different one later?

Kindergarden, this is where we are right now. I'm not being too serious, am I?

And when was God ever impressed or obligated to you? Or for that matter, to me or anyone? Just how small is thing you have been referring to as your God?

_________________
God of Poly-Folly Folly

{ If you believe in things that you don't understand, then you suffer ~ Stevie Wonder }
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God of Poly-Folly Folly